Is anybody using unconverted (non-sanke) cornelius kegs to sell beer to customers? I see that there is a very large supply of these available, they seem to hold carbonation fine and clean ok, but I haven't seen them on the bar circuit. Can somebody enlighten me a bit?
We use them. They clean, fill, and dispense just fine. They are less durable than purpose-built beer kegs, but we can deal with that. Use different couplers than Sankey, but you knew that. Four of them can fit in a cooler designed for one fat American half-barrel keg. What else do you want to know?
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Phillip Kelm
Engineer/Brewer
Currently managing the Palau Brewing Company
Palau, Micronesia
We've used them for a while with no problems. We don't use them for commercial accounts though, just for public purchases. The connections for them are fairly cheap too, just make sure that you put a check valve in the gas lines.
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Steve Bradt
Free State Brewing Co.
Lawrence, KS
We use them. They clean, fill, and dispense just fine. They are less durable than purpose-built beer kegs, but we can deal with that. Use different couplers than Sankey, but you knew that. Four of them can fit in a cooler designed for one fat American half-barrel keg. What else do you want to know?
Are commercial accounts ok with having a different set of connections for a given tap handle?
I could see this as being a serious cost-saver for a small startup, but would be concerned that a bar might not be so eager to switch over a tap handle to connections that would essentially limit what they could dispense.
I would think most bars would not be interested in putting your proprietary fittings on their draft system. Yeah I know it is not YOUR design but no one else will be able to slide their keg in without a tap switch. Let us not forget you will be commiting to servicing their system, since you will be the only one with that setup. Teaching servers how to tell the difference between the CO2 and liquid fittings would be fun to watch, leading to the never ending phone calls in the middle of the night. You may get a few to do it, but in the long run I think it just gives potential customers another reason to say no. I guess it would really depend on how many customers can you get to say yes.
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Joel Halbleib
Zymurgist
Bluegrass Brewing Co
636 East Main St
Louisville, KY
www.bluegrassbrewing.com
Regarding the propriety of corny fittings; wouldn't it be the same with Sanke? Do you get a coupler when you win an account? My experience is that you get a spot in a cooler. You then have to install the right length of appropriate tubing, coupler, and gas fitting. You are also obligated to clean the lines--at least in most states. I don't think the bar owner gives a damn about the coupler as long as you have quality pouring out the faucet.
Regarding training issues, it's not that complicated. Gas fittings are white. Liquid fittings are black. The corny almost always is embossed with an "IN" next to the gas inlet. We use protective caps (available from Foxx) on both the liquid and gas valves on the tanks. Clear caps for the gas, and colored ones for liquid. We also put plastic tags with our logo and beer type on the liquid valve. As idiot-proof as this is, we also get a call once in a while to "fix" our dispense. Unless the caller is a total moron, I can usually walk them through the "fix" over the phone.
I can recommend using corny kegs--we've done it for ten years with very few problems. Just realize that they are not as durable, but for the price I can live with that.
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Phillip Kelm
Engineer/Brewer
Currently managing the Palau Brewing Company
Palau, Micronesia
We've been using them now for close to 3 years. We do try to idiot-proof the hookup by painting the rubber around the gas-in fitting white. It helps but there's no such thing as absolutely idiot-proof.
You will need to stock up on spare parts (poppets, o-rings, etc.) since they are generally not as reliable as commercial fittings. We also build in procedures for testing kegs before we fill them - after santization we gas them up and spray all entry/exit points and look for leaks. We also do this before kegs leave the walk-in to the customer. It takes a little extra work but you get used to it.
I don't know how accounts in the US will tolerate them. Here, we have to give the account everything (chiller, taps, towers, CO2) so they pretty much couldn't care less what our fittings look like. They're not supposed to use them for other kegs anyway.
Are commercial accounts ok with having a different set of connections for a given tap handle?
I could see this as being a serious cost-saver for a small startup, but would be concerned that a bar might not be so eager to switch over a tap handle to connections that would essentially limit what they could dispense.
they make 1/4" MFL to tailpiece so if you installed flare nut and stems on the lines the switch over to a sanke would be easy. they also sell flare to cornie plug adapters so you could put gas and liquid plugs right on the sanke coupler with the tailpieces.
Have you considered sanke-converted Hoff-Stevens kegs? They can be bought for the same price as soda cornie kegs but hold more volume. Or are you trying to avoid the sanke thing?
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